Army veteran Joe Meisch had one of those random ideas to create something to solve a problem.  Who would have through that this random idea would have come at the same time as a potential to have his comedy show pilot episode be considered for mainstream TV.  Joe felt this need to focus on his invention and do something to honor his battle buddies who are no longer here.  What started as a temple massager to help relieve headaches has turned into an awesome, USA made tool to help with various issues from headaches, tension and ptsd relief. 

Battle Buddy Podcast Guest Links:

https://www.templemassager.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/joe-meisch-a66443b/

Craig Steinbrook: https://www.stainbrookllp.com/

Larry Childs: https://www.linkedin.com/in/larry-childs-497b1226/

Battle Buddy Podcast Links:

https://linktr.ee/battlebuddypodcast 

Transcript from Episode 61 with Joe Meisch:

Keith McKeever 0:02

Welcome to the battle buddy podcast with Keith McKeever. Welcome back to another episode of the battle buddy podcast, I've got an awesome guest today you're gonna want to tune in is, especially if you're interested in PTSD or you suffer from PTSD. Some other things, Joe is gonna tell us all about it. But I've got Joe mice with me today. I'll bring them up in a second. But I just want to say, if you find this story powerful or inspirational, or any other story that I've done on my podcast, make sure you share that power here is sharing this with other veterans that may find it useful, knowledgeable, or find something actionable that they can do out of it. So without further ado, welcome Joe to the show.

Joe Meisch 0:42

Hey, Keith, thanks for having me on. Yeah,

Keith McKeever 0:45

no problem. I'm really glad to have you here. And you originally, if I remember, right, because memory sucks. Sometimes you reached out to me on LinkedIn. And you're like, hey, got this cool product. And I will just jump right to it here. I'll throw the banner up here. And I was immediately intrigued. So you got the temple massager. And of course, I gotta head on. But General, I know you got yours right there, you could demonstrate it for us. But this, obviously massages your temples in a way to reduce some stress. But we'll get into that in a minute. But you have an interesting, interesting might be an understatement, you have a very interesting past. I let you share kind of you know, your, your, your military past and all that, but definitely want to hear from you the insights into the entertainment industry, you know, like, comedy shows all this different, what are all those different things that you've done? So tell us who you are. And it catches up to today. All right, cool.

Joe Meisch 1:41

So I was in the army 13 years total time and as a combat engineer, 12 Bravo 62 Juliet, and Guard Reserve active duty. So I kind of covered all the, the potential Army career and you know, really enjoyed my career. I, I'm proud of it, you know, I will say at the end of it, I was kind of tired of it. And I didn't want to think about it much. And but now, you know, as time has passed, I'm stoked to be a veteran man. I'm so happy I serve. And even though that was tough places and stuff, and I will say I am not a combat that I just like that distinction, because I got a lot of friends that are combat vets and friend of mine, he was carrying Iraq after right after I got out my supervisor, everybody got deployed post 911. So I just want to put that out there. You know, it's a combat engineer title, I wasn't in combat, so and I got that level of respect for my brothers and sisters that happen there. So I just want to make that delineation, if you will. So I had a cool career in did a lot of different things. And I enjoyed it. I'm proud of my career, and lucky to meet the people I did. And so at the end of it, basically, I still kind of deal with in a clinch really bad. Just hold my jaw tight, ground, my teeth flat, and it was all stress. And it was from Military School work, you know, working class guy here, so I never had that stress free, easy going lifestyle that maybe some people have, but it caused me headaches and clenching my jaw really bad. And so like a good army grunt or lazy caveman, you might, I got tired holding up my arms and shoulders, I end up going like this quite a bit. And then I take my thumbs and I would dig under my cheekbone and try to relax and I realized oh, my man and engaging my shoulder, my arms will look how much muscle that is engagement in my neck. I'm creating tension. Yeah, it feels good for a little bit, but I'm creating tension by just holding up my arms and shoulders. So I literally went out to buy a temple massage. I'm like, somebody has to have made a temple massage. While they didn't. And so I was like, wow, it's just one of those moments that you hear about that light bulb going off, you know, and so do a long process and many years, just like you got your temple massage, or I got my temple massager. And you know, basically, it's kind of hard to stop doing that. It feels really good. So I got a little tension here. But went through the long process of venting it patenting it, and I couldn't afford a patent attorney. So I learned how to write patents. So I looked at pads of other peoples that were on file with the US patent trademark office uspto.gov Zoo website, and I learned I had to learn, you know, and I ended up working with a patent attorney He's like, okay, man, I'm 400 bucks an hour. And if you don't have the money to pay that, then what you could do is look at all the patents that we regenerate through our patent search that generated all these different patents that might have something to do with the temple massager, and then write you on Pat. He was like, You got clear clearance for me to go get a patent Joe, I don't see any patented product out there that's resembling the tumble massager. Go for it. But the workload fell on my shoulders to learn how to write. And he guided me a course you know, cost me way less money by doing the work as much as I could that he comes through it with the legalese.

Keith McKeever 5:42

That'd be a big learning curve to I mean, I 90, people aren't gonna have a clue how to do any of that,

Joe Meisch 5:48

Oh, man. Some of the stuff that they come at you with this abstract thinking and writing a patent, I was lost. I'm like, I don't get where you're going with this. But if it's legally necessary, well, then that's what we're doing. So it can be challenged man, but I liked that challenge. I'm a fighter and my nature, you know. And so anyway, it got the patent. And then, about that time to deal deal with my stress fracture, started using my prototypes, getting feedback from people. And like you kind of alluded to, I was actually writing some comedy down in LA and I had a TV show and got to work with a great some great people, Michael Weinberg. He's a great producer. He did the David Spade show. And America's Got Talent, some of the big things he's did that people might recognize. And it was it was crazy man. I was doing a construction job in San Francisco and a remodel. And the boss had a party on his yacht to Sausalito. And I'm like, I'm going to the party. Man. I'm not that kind of guy. I don't get invited to yacht parties.

Keith McKeever 6:59

Hey, you get that? I mean, you gotta go. Yeah, that doesn't

Joe Meisch 7:02

go to my past me very often bad. So I'm like, I'll go to the party. So anyway, I just also read a book about writing TV shows. And it was called breakfast with sharks. And I read it and like the big takeaway was keep a pilot of your work on you at all times. You never know who you're going to meet, where you're going to beat up. So I literally had this pilot idea. Just a CD, I had a desk, right. And on the boat, I meet Michael Mian from the mayhem brothers comedy troupe in San Francisco. And they were stage and TV and they do, they're in the business. And he does construction part time. And so I ended up seeing him on the boat. I made him we talk. He was doing Robot Wars at the time, which was kind of like BattleBots a little bit. And I said, So what are you doing these days? He's that guy. Not then and you kind of have something crazy wild, you know, and I'm like, I gotta go crazy wild. It was it. And I showed him the pilot on just bought his laptop on the boat in Sausalito. And, and he laughed, and we talked a little bit about it. He's like, That's funny. And that was it. Like I was like, Oh, cool. I got to show it to somebody right on Okay, party ends. Monday comes around, and I'm going up on Russian Hill to do this remodel. And here's this dark, shadowy figure at the door to get into the job. And it's Michael, Ben, and I'm like, Oh, hey, Michael. We're gonna work together on the job killer. We're gonna be laughing so much. We're never gonna get anything done, you know? And he's like, No, I'm not worried. He's all cold. And, you know, no, I'm not working with you today. It's gonna like, okay. He's like, but I couldn't stop thinking about your stupid pilot. That's funny. Dumb, funny. Stop away. Talk to Michael Morton Olson, who's a writer in Hollywood guide. Tell him I take your he won't talk to you. I talked to him. He's like you said, you know. I felt like I'm dealing with the budget senior NCOs man like, it was kind of a tense, you know?

Keith McKeever 9:16

Almost sounds like the mob to me. Yeah.

Joe Meisch 9:20

And he's like, I'm like Michael, meet Michael pitcher. So me, Michael. Michael pitcher. It wasn't like it was Michael mayhem for the beat. Oh, yeah. Okay, no, Michael, what do you got? Boom. I sent him the pilot. And he's like, this is great. I'm a writer on your show. And one call on like, I write on my show. Okay. I don't really have a show quite yet. I want to talk with Michael. I just said his name. Michael Weinberg is a huge TV Tollywood guy. Tell him I sent you he won't talk to you. Okay. And so I talked to him Michael Weinberg. And he was like, Hey, you guys same thing all over again. Do you? Michael or Martin Olson do Michael vn Okay, what do you got? What's going on? Well, I just show ID and blah blah blah. Is Morton thing just good? I want to meet you for coffee in Pacific Palisades. Okay, cool. And I go down there and I meet him for coffee. And I show him this quick little pilot. And he's like, this is great. I want to take it to Comedy Central with me. Are you cool with that? And I was like, I think I hear you. What do you say? Because I couldn't believe it was happening. And he was like, he and I just fell straight with each other. A couple of veterans talking. And it was really cool. His dad, by the way, is a world war two veteran that was swampy, 70s and daylight rates of Germany. So he has this cool respect for veterans. And I really appreciated that. And he showed that and so I was like, you want to take my thing to come on? Like, what do you say? Say that again? He says, fuck you, Joe Moishe. You heard me? And I said, Yeah, I heard you. I just can't believe you said that. So I want to hear Yeah, I'm like, you want to take my stuff to Comedy Central? Like right now? We'll Yeah, let me think about it, dude. No, of course, yes. Taking Can I go with you. Now he's like, going nowhere to go cool. Dude, you know, and he watched my pilot was jacket over his head and the screen of the laptop. So he was protecting my intellectual property. And I was like, okay, I can trust this guy. So then basically, you know, I'm still working on the tempo massager, and going back to LA and up to northern California. And then I got an offer. We sat with Comedy Central. That was cool. You know, on one little side note there, like, I'm sitting there with Michael Weinberg. And I'm like, I can't believe I'm here, man. And, like, get in the building. You have to show your ID right century cities and Culver City's hatchery towers I call that's one of the big network people are in their offices. And so like, I just got walked off my game a little bit. I forgot my wallet back and where I'm standing. So we're going up to the counter, the check in security guys are there and Michael's like, Hey, you got your ID, right. I'm like, boy, and he's like, Dude, you just blew your opportunity. You're not gonna get in. And because everybody's checking IDs and everything. After 911, right? You're gonna remember this was back in 2006 or something. And so I could like, just go the counter to go to counter Come on. He was really great. And stop out, step on the line and go, nope, you blew it. I gotta go. And I should just Just listen to me do please just go to the counter. I go to the counter. There's a Marine Corps veteran with a pen, separate pie pen. And like, Okay, I got this. And he's like, Hey, gentlemen, meeting. Oh, yeah. Joe Marsh, Michael Weinberg, Comedy Central Zoey Friedman, blah, blah, blah. Okay, cool. Yeah, I got you here. Id gentleman. Michael immediately has his and I looked at the guy and as a simplified brother. Separate lab Arantes, always working engineers, right. And he's like, oh, what were you and I'm like army engineer told Bravo. And he's like, Dude, you guys are always blowing stuff up. I was wanting to be an engineer. I envied you guys. You know, watching you do it. And you always cleared the way for us. You know? And you know, that military thing is it's like, I've had World War Two veterans come up to me, and we start talking, or I've done other shows or whatever. And it's like, you guys cleared the waves like you were there. You know, but it's just that camaraderie, family. You know, World War Two, Vietnam. Korea doesn't matter, man. That

Keith McKeever 13:48

dysfunctional family.

Joe Meisch 13:50

Yeah. And it flows through, you know, generational, so he was like, Man, you guys got me through. So I said, Yeah, I could be an engineer and liked it. And without like, skipping a beat. I said, Yeah, I'd love to be an engineer. It was fun, man. And by the way, I completely got nervous and forgot my ID to get in here today. I kind of blew it to go pitch this TV show. And he says, Oh, no problem, dude. You're gonna have a great meeting. Elevators right there, brother. I turn a walk with Michael we're going to the elevator. Michael Weinberg turns to me and he says, Dude, I've been in Hollywood 20 years. I didn't know anybody that could do what you just did. And I'm like, that's that veteran brotherhood man and I'm proud as hell and love it. And I love my family, my community. So anyway, we can when we pitch and they offer they said you know, we'd love it like to be here two weeks later. We'd love it and but it's not for it's not for Comedy Central but we want you to go to common Spike TV. So I go to Spike TV and I got an offer. My agent calls me and she's like, Yeah, man, you got an offer and blah, blah, blah. And it wasn't much money because you're starting out. And then I do the temple massage thing was being sent all over the world Iraq, Afghanistan, Djibouti Bach rain launch to a Walter Reed, Bethesda, you name it. I'm like, I'm just giving these away. Because I serve it you guys gave all one guy drowned on the private Kurdish showing and training or reserve. And then after I just got out my supervisor, my Kundalini was KBIA in Iraq, right. So these guys are on my mind, and it gives me the energy to push this thing forward. That's why I have this decision. You know, I can't do temple massager and be in LA doing a TV show. And, man, it was hard. It was tough. But I did it. I walked away from the TV offer to focus on Temple massager. And I'm proud I did this sometimes I think, oh, what could have happened? Whatever, dude, I feel that sense of purpose serving other people more so than be chasing my dreams. But this is a dream I'm chasing, you know, so I walked away from Hollywood. And and then I went on to donate over 5000 Temple massagers to service members and veterans, and first responders all around the world. So there's the quick background, military and the whole Hollywood thing. And we'll take a break there and, like, ask me, So,

Keith McKeever 16:20

ya know, that's, you kind of answered the first question I had, you know, what was? What was the idea and the inspiration behind it. And you know, there's nothing like, seeing what goes on in your community, you know, the veteran community, to inspire people to do something. I mean, that's, that's the very reason I started this podcast. So seeing people struggling on Facebook groups and stuff. And I'm like, Man, I love podcasts, right? I like to talk I can, I can talk quite a bit. I know, don't talk too much on the podcast. But, you know, bring people on to talk about things that are valuable to the community, like, like your story, and the other 50 or 60, that I've done on various topics, right, just to just to help people just to provide that education. So you know, that I totally understand that mindset of, there's something I can do. You know, there's, you can always argue there's something that all of us can do to give back to our community.

Joe Meisch 17:17

Yeah, absolutely. Whether it's something you created or going volunteering for a day, and

Keith McKeever 17:22

exactly, it doesn't have to be big, you know, as small things helped to, you know, whether it's a rake in the yard for the World War Two veteran down the street this fall, you know, you know, like small little tokens of appreciation have big impacts.

Joe Meisch 17:36

I tell people, I've talked to tons of combat Vets through my donations and different groups, I work with Wounded Warrior Project, just all this great engagement. And sometimes I hear folks talk and even just civilians and they're like, Man, I'm, I'm kind of down in the funk. And I'm not happy with my life or whatever aspect or they're kind of not happy about and like you, you want to make sure you feel that go there, kind of go to a store or gas station or whatever. Go open a door for somebody, and just hold the door open for them. And they're going to say thank you, and you are going to feel some worth in that exact moment. And you're going to feel good. You can take that pain. And you can go turn around and say, hey, you know, I'm gonna go volunteer somewhere. Like I've volunteered for some homeless shelters. And I've gone and hung out with people that were homeless, and I'm not threatened by that. I'm a big guy. I'm six, four to 40. You know, and I'm not threatened by a lot. So I didn't feel up here. But you find out people have had one or two little things wrong, and they're down on their luck and next year on your on their street. So I'm always telling people to do some small thing, man, you don't have to be big, you know, to feel good about yourself. It's called serving a purpose, right? We're military veterans. Man, I have that instinctual thing. I'm a vet, called arrogant, that's fine, whatever. I'm like, I feel like I've got little edge over the average Joe. And I can say that, of course, because I'm Joe. So I'm like, I got a little edge on other people. I think, you know, maybe sometimes I think maybe sometimes I don't. So I want to go and see what people are doing and how they're living. And if I can offer any kind of guidance or suggestion or maybe donate a tumbler so hours, then I try to keep that as part of my life to pay back pay for given back so comfortable. So I was really allowed me to do that. And I'll tell you, I mean, I feel blessed that I have the strength to get through to make this thing because it is not easy. And so just as a side note, my knowledge base that I've gained from all this, I want to share with other people. So anybody that's watching your podcast, you know, feel free to forward in my contact. I'm my email is Joe at Temple massager.com I know people have ideas and They want to make you chase a dream. And I'm always here to help it give free advice, because when I'm doing it, people are like, oh, you know, I'll help you. I'll help you. I'll help it. And you're like, how much? How much? And I'm like, I can't afford you, man, how much a boy. So I've paid. And I've worked through and learned and got through. So I'm always phrase is a veteran out there that has an idea for a TV show, a product or a patent or anything? I'm always happy to help them for free. No problem. I'll give you my straight up advice. If I don't know. I'll tell you. I don't know. So, but just to the goodwill and feedback I can get from the top massagers is paid dividends, man. In fact, you know, I exhibited my jaw pain right underneath here. It just I love to break my jaw and let it hang down. I never saw the mental health aspect of this coming in, for PTS for anxiety for negative intrusive thoughts, distraction, anxiety relief, this is all learned. And like I got feedback from Walter Reed, because when I donate to Walter Reed, they put him in behavioral health chapels office and resiliency clinic. And suddenly, I start here and from counselors that are working with combat vets. And people like oh, hey, it's helping me with my anxiety. My negative intrusive thoughts are distracted. And I wasn't sure how all this is working. I was taking headache and jaw pain relief. So I ended up working with this guy, Dr. Mark Abramson from Stanford School of Medicine, mindfulness based stress clinic, huge guy, he gets paid to go into all these huge corporations and talk about mindfulness and stress management.

Keith McKeever 21:46

I bet that title fits on the entire business card doesn't

Joe Meisch 21:51

like this long. It's been in the military for a million years. And he leans to the left, because he's got a billion ribbons on his left side. Yeah.

Keith McKeever 22:03

Yeah. Because I was gonna ask you about the response you've gotten. But I wanted to back up for a second. Yeah, you mentioned your contact information. And I just want to put this out there. To the listeners, viewers of the show, I put a picture and a link to contact all of my past guests on my website. So if you didn't catch his his email address, and you don't get your show notes, you go to the website to and find a way to connect with Joe. I think it's really important to give that ability for people who listen to any episode to be able to go connect with that person. So but the but the responses that I was really curious to hear about this, because we've talked before the response on your product.

Joe Meisch 22:43

Yeah, so a lot of it's been to pure discovery, just by creating it, and reinventing it, making it better whatever. I get all the psycho psychological feedback again, anxiety, stress, negative thoughts. So I work with this guys at Stanford. And he's like, Joe, you're getting these responses because your products triggering the relaxation response. And I'm like, Okay, explain that because I don't have a medical background. And he says, Okay, well, when you go get a haircut, are you going to get a massage and you kind of sitting there laying there. And you know, they're they're touching your scalp and working on your hair, or their work in the shoulders or feet? And he says to me, what comes out of your mouth at that point? I'm like, a ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, like, ah, like, that feels good. Ah, this is exactly that is a delay reaction. From your autonomic nervous system, your nerves and the side of your head, your trigeminal nerve, and your master temporalis muscles are tied into that your teeth are tied into the trigeminal nerve, all your facial muscles. And he's like you're stimulating the autonomic nervous system is triggering the relaxation response and edit delay reaction. Would you say? Ah, that feels good. Right on okay. Your brain is already producing more dopamine, endorphins, and serotonin. And that Joe, is why you're getting this mental health, psychological oriented feedback. And I was like, never saw that coming. Right on I got a new way to help people be beyond the physical muscle tension relief by hitting your master and temporales. So that was incredibly powerful. And, you know, like, he wrote this unbelievable letter talking about oh, combat soldiers are going to be able to calm down quicker after combat patrols. A year later, dude. A year later or less, I get a letter from combat commander in Afghanistan on army letterhead stating how it's helping combat service members. You know, come down to a base level I'm okay feeling and get rid of the adrenaline cortisol as quickly as possible and feel more calm and relaxed after combat patrols. And so I'm like, Dr. Anderson, you actually foretold what came to be. So I got a business letter. And then I get the combat commanders letter that was incredible to see and witness some, like, pure discovery through the innovation. While

Keith McKeever 25:20

Yeah, I think there's a lot to that. First, I wanted to say on top of you know what it's doing with the nerves, there might also be something to the fact that you're distracting yourself. But now I got something in my hands. And I'm doing something else. Like you're, you're actively engaging your hands in motion and doing something.

Joe Meisch 25:39

Yeah, let me let me speak to that sitting there

Keith McKeever 25:41

and just kind of, you know, thinking, it's yes, great

Joe Meisch 25:45

to try to meditate, some people can do it, some people have a really hard time breaking that awareness. Because if you're wearing or you're looking at your surroundings, you're not gonna be able to meditate. So Abraham, say, like, I work with a doctor, and this guy was a counselor, and he was a colonel and he was like, show your products acting, I could pre meditational calming distraction. So it turns your awareness off, right? Like when you start using it, your eyes want to close, I mean, you can sit there and make sure your eyes are open and keep your jaw tense, as keep thinking about your bills and your problems and what's not right in your life. I would say don't use the product, don't buy it. Don't waste your time. It's not got work. Not imagine one man, you got to participate. You gotta want to say, feels good. You gotta want to let your head down and let your mouth hanging open. Be mindful. So mindfulness is our product.

Keith McKeever 26:39

You're not going to get the full effect, you're gonna get 10% 15% Like it might feel good, but it's not going to be everything.

Joe Meisch 26:47

Yep. So you mentioned the distraction. So I put an aromatherapy pad on the front of it. So as I'm stimulating here are trigeminal nerve masseter muscle, all that I could put aromatherapy on this white pad. Look, look. Wow, it's like right under my nose. So if I'm practicing deep breathing, I'm getting a massive, I don't know I'm getting ahead right. I'm gonna hit of lavender oil or whatever oil you want to put on there comes with lavender by the product comes with lavender. And select up on the handle. There's a lotion roll up which is mango butter, shea butter, coconut oil, beeswax, and it had the manufacturer put in Arnica, which is an over the counter herb for pain relief. And I have the person add St. John's wort, which is an inflammation relief. It's all topical. So when you're putting implement anti inflammation and anti pain, or pain relief, the lotion is there to break the friction so you don't irritate your skin by by using the tip of Fox too much it can irritate your skin. So I made this lotion, it was a great opportunity to put in some pain relief and inflammation. And then there's lavender oil will vile here's got lavender oil. So basically that lavender oil is there to stimulate the all factory nerve and I got a big one

Joe Meisch 28:19

more of a schnoz.

Joe Meisch 28:24

Other than making fun of myself, hey, you

Keith McKeever 28:25

know you got to.

Joe Meisch 28:27

So that's called your olfactory nerve, just being serious for half a second. So while you're getting this autonomic nervous system stimulation up here, simultaneously, if you're using the aromatherapy, you're getting the olfactory stimulation. So again, the doctors were at Stanford like this is causing a distraction when you get this powerful smell right under your nose. The deep breathing lowers your blood pressure, that's just a matter of fact, deep breathing lowers blood pressure. So you're encouraging people to do breathe deep breathing to get the aromatherapy, you're distracting them. You're lowering the heart rate and blood pressure. And then this autonomic thing is causing you to say, Ah, so there's this mental, mental and physical effect of the product. And I'm like, Man, this is crazy. You know, this is way more than I thought it would be.

Keith McKeever 29:17

As they're close, you know, you should be able to focus more on those other senses, the sense of touch and smell and not be distracted by sight.

Joe Meisch 29:26

Yeah. So ideally, you're in a room where the lights are out and kind of amplify the

Keith McKeever 29:30

effect of that even more if you're if your eyes are closed.

Joe Meisch 29:35

Yeah, and the cool thing is, it's so portable, you can use it your car at home. You're parked somewhere, don't use it while you're driving. I don't recommend that.

Keith McKeever 29:43

Probably not a good idea. Yeah, well,

Joe Meisch 29:47

climber. So basically, this whole mental aspect, psychological aspect and the physiological aspect of the muscle tension. So I've gotten tons of letters from combat Veterans veterans talking about their headache relief. I've worked with migraines again and migraine awareness groups, we donated them got feedback from migraine headache relief, I was getting migraine, again an aura in my left eye and look like sunlight off of water glistening. And I wouldn't be like letters have been missing from words I couldn't see and I'm like, oh my god, I'm about to get a migraine. And also sit back, you know, and just rank a deal. I'd be leaning back. This rig back and forth on my temporalis muscle. Right around my ear. I'll tighten it up. No, breathe deep. And for me doing that 15 minutes leaning back resting, my head's at rest. I'm breathing deep. I can actually get rid of my migraine before it sets in. And I know words appear holes I'm reading. But I got to stop like turn the lights off. No TV, turn the phone off, close the door. Leave me alone signs everywhere. And you got to focus but so we've worked with some people helping get rid of their migraines. I had a person on LinkedIn I connected with just like you. He is a tinnitus, social media influencer. And he was like, Hey, man, I think your thing's going to help us somatic tinnitus, because I'm always rubbing right front of my ear to get rid of my ringing and I'm like, wow, okay, yeah, let's talk. I sent him a device. Three months, I thought he blew me off three months later. He's like, Hey, man, I did the video. It's up. And I looked down and He's raving about he's like, this is great. I love it for my tinnitus. And so boom, up to the day. Because of his tinnitus, tinnitus video, I'm still getting sales, and I get a little discount. So I got a code. But I can tell it's a rewiring tinnitus video viewer that went and bought one. So there's a tinnitus thing, and I don't have medical studies on and I'm not trying to blow smoke here, or lie to people or make things up. I'm just telling you, people have tried it. They reviewed it. They're the ones putting the videos out because it's helping them in that sense. So I'm just real transparent man. I'm not trying to sell a product. But you know, when people are using it, and they give their credibility out there. That's good enough for me if it's working just like on the combat soldiers, the veterans, first responders, you know, their words speak louder than mine.

Keith McKeever 32:38

Yeah, well, there's no doubt about it, that there's a lot of tools people can try. But this is a lot better than drugs and alcohol, or self harm in other ways.

Joe Meisch 32:50

No, I'm in the Medicare system. Absolutely. Okay, so check it out. Man. I sometimes I don't talk about this. It depends on who I'm talking to. And sometimes I worry too much, maybe. But this product is the latest version. And I made it from ballistic nylon. And there's many reasons but one of them was like I've talked with a lot of doctors and PhDs wasn't was Dr. Shawna Springer. She's an author and a well known Doctor PhD that's worked with combat troops forever. It's just super cool. She interviewed me and I talk with her and I showed him I made this thing out of ballistic nylon. And I kind of reshape the handle. Like I wanted to fill your hand right? And cuz I've dealt with, like, I've had people write me say, Hey, man, I'm not thinking about my suicidal ideation. What suicidal idea into templates are just helping with that. I'm like, man, it's just incredibly powerful. And I talk to Andrew Epson again, I'm like, Hey, man, why people telling me suicidal ideation distraction? Well, Joe goes back into distraction, the olfactory and the stimulation here. He can't think about much. So suicidally, and then you can interrupt them with this. He's like, Joe, you're doing a world's good?

Keith McKeever 34:13

Yeah. Well, not only you got to think about the fact that you're not only impacting them. You're impacting everybody around their life, their loved ones, their kids, their spouse, their parents, siblings, whatever anybody in their life is that's just a that's keeping them alive. One more day. Yeah, way longer than that, you know, and that makes a positive impact.

Joe Meisch 34:38

Do right there that one so I got a letter. This all started because of one email from a combat medic. He was either in South Korea or Japan. This guy writes me and he says, Hey, do you offer discounts? I've marked my risks with a knife. I'm in a bad way. And the person that usually does my tumble massaging isn't available. And I found your telling massager online. I just by searching temple massage. And I was like, Yeah, we're offered discounts How about free purchase pay and I served with two guys that gave all their Spirit keeps driving me on. And so this is free brother Give me your APO right military shipping address. They still call it an APO military trust as far

Keith McKeever 35:17

as I know. Yeah. Wasn't when I was in FTO is whatever something like? Yeah, there's a couple of levels.

Joe Meisch 35:24

So he sends me an address, I send it. months goes by It was right before Christmas. And I wrote him after that in July, January. And I said, Hey, man, did you get it? Did it help you? He writes me back. And he says, The things helped me Yes, I owe you huge grid, a huge debt of gratitude. I feel okay for me to feel okay. is significant in light of 17 months of panic attacks, suicidal ideation and anxiety attacks. Thank you, sincerely. Thank you. I have an email. And it's not that was published in his email was not published. His comments were published in a San Francisco Chronicle newspaper article, because I went up to the town of Paradise after the town burned off the map, and I donated to the first responders. So anyway, getting back to the construction, Dr. Shoulder Springer. And my thought process, I thought to myself, I want to make the handle bigger, I want to fill a hand. Because I know from reading tons of shit, too many veterans hold weapons to feel that safety, comfort and security. It has conditioned in you in a military service member, especially here to kind of ground pounder, you're holding your weapon, because that's what's going to save your bacon. Right? So after you get out of the military, there's no real deep and unconditioned thing of that. So I hear from all the counselors Oh, too many veterans hold guns. Well, man, if you're holding a gun, and you're not feeling good, or you maybe drank or use a kind of drugs or pharmaceuticals street, I don't care, it don't matter. The point is, maybe you shouldn't be holding a gun for comfort security. So I was like, Man, I wonder if I make the handle bigger. And I wonder if I can get a mold made that makes out of ballistic nylon? will it hold up to the oil penetrating it? And the answer was yes. Yes. And yes. So this is the latest version of the temple, Sergeant's made a ballistic nylon. And so I talked with Dr. Springer and she's like, Joe, what you did is cold habit replacement therapy. You took something that feels like a gun, because the pistol grips and hand guards of em sixteens and rifles are made of ballistic nylon. So she's like you took weapons material, mended healing material for distracting for all these negative intrusive thoughts that people might potentially have. And that's called habit replacement therapy. So congratulations, Joe, through discovery, you're potentially helping people with suicidal ideation, distraction. And I got that email and I work with the doctors, Stanford and Shawn Springer and all these people. And it's a blessing dude. You know, it makes walking away from Hollywood that much easier. I have zero regrets. Zero. Walk away from Hollywood again, right now. Because of that one emails, not combat medic, I do in a heartbeat. That one email was enough to make me satisfied as a human being helping people my personal desires and dreams are worthless. I find my gold of living and helping people man like I've had some people telling me where I live. Oh, have you made the million church? Oh, you make the money yet? And I'm like, you know, I've been paid will say companies still technically owes me money, you know, because I focused on donating. But I said I have been paid. I just haven't made any money. It's what I say. I get paid. I just have the money. And they're like, What do you mean by that? And I'm like, Look, man, I got paid in the sense that I got gold, platinum diamonds, rubies. filling my pockets. They're just the ones I can't show you and I can't spend them. But they are the payment of gold, jewels, rubies, whatever you can think of value in this world. I get to take those to my grave with me. So yeah, I've been paid brother. Not a problem.

Keith McKeever 39:26

Good. Good point. And man, your man. There's a little bit to unpack in there. You know, I did not have to do with the show. I really did not know that a lot of veterans were doing that that they were just sitting there holding a gun. It makes sense. It definitely makes sense. I didn't know that. And we say that and I eventually reached over and grabbed enough said here hold it in my hand and it's like that is pretty darn close to a pistol grip on a rifle exact but it's close. Is it is eerily close to that. And I can I can see it now, like I'm holding it, I'm like, yeah, yeah, I can see that that's close enough. So instead

Joe Meisch 40:11

of putting a gun to your head, because you're holding it for comfort, security, whatever, you know, maybe you put a ton of massage into your head and let it do its work with the stimulation and the distraction that don't just be calm, just be alone with your thoughts and be calm. And if it leaves you in a pre meditative state, will then drop the temple massager on the floor and go into meditation if you can, ideally, that would be a nice progression.

Keith McKeever 40:39

Yeah, I kind of want to kind of flip the script here, I'm gonna scroll this at the bottom. But I just want to say for a second to anybody who's listening to this and is having problems, you definitely should look at it. Go get the temple massager. But obviously, it takes a little while to ship. So I've got the National Suicide Prevention life lifeline number scrolling at the bottom, you can it's on the screen of my video too when I play that. But I guess I just want to take a moment and just say to those who are struggling, we want you Joe and I want you all your other veteran brothers and sisters, we want you here tomorrow, and the next day and the next day, the next day. That's what's important. We kind of mentioned earlier, we're big family. We just felt okay, we might be really dysfunctional. But we're a big family. And at the end of the day, we don't want you know, I think we're all sick and tired. of of the 22 A or 33 a day or whatever the freakin statistic is today. We're tired of it, do something and this, this is definitely something that I can see helping. may not help everybody. But it has certainly helped a lot of people.

Joe Meisch 41:47

If it distracts your thoughts for you know a little bit and then I'm doing my job, you know, and, and it works with the counseling and it works with if you're on a pharmaceutical I get it man, I just had knee replacement surgery. Sometimes pills are necessary. But like, you know, I work with Dr. Mahina, Adams, the Stanford Palo Alto VA. She's like, Joe, the cool thing about your product is it worked with everything that works with therapy, it works with clinicians that work with the pharmaceutical, it's portable, you know, so,

Keith McKeever 42:18

yeah, long time to do just a couple of minutes.

Joe Meisch 42:21

It can, it's easy. And I always tell people continue with your counseling, talking with people. This, you know, it's a great little tool, but it is not a magic wand. I always tell people, if you're going to use this, that's fine. I'd love you to do and I'd love to hear from you. And I hope it helps. But you need to continue the counseling that therapy, speaking with people immersion therapy, whatever it is you're doing, that's helpful massager is not going to replace anything. It's another tool to add to the toolbox, if you will,

Keith McKeever 42:54

you know Yeah, cuz getting better is a holistic approach, right? You need to look at his holistic approach. It's not just one tool. Because if you go to a mechanic with your car, and you've got one wrench, it ain't gonna do shit for you. Like you got to you got to feel that toolbox with a bunch of tools,

Joe Meisch 43:12

you know, tools, and so should everybody else

Keith McKeever 43:16

know what you need, what do you need for the job? You know? And it's just part of it. So, yes, you know, and it's, like you said, you know, the materials you made it out of it's really lightweight. I mean, just saying, it doesn't weigh much of anything. I mean, most of the weights, obviously the handle, with the lotion, all that stuff in there, too. But

Joe Meisch 43:36

you know, I wanted it to be tough. And, and I know your next question is Joe, we're, where's this thing made up? Brother?

Keith McKeever 43:46

That is literally my next question. I wish I could show on my screen. Where's your product made?

Joe Meisch 43:51

It's made in USA. There's a patent number. And I'm not being sour grapes here. But I will say I never had any big investors for all kinds of reasons, you know. And most of them weren't good. But a lot of them in the early days were like, We want you to make it in China. And I said, Well, why don't you go to China? At palm salt along the way? Because you're an idiot. Well, well, Joey can't talk to us like that. I'm like, Listen, brother, there ain't no echo in this fucking room. You heard me. Don't fucking play with me. You're so stupid. I would never take a penny of your money. Well, what's your problem? Why shops? Your Cupid's off. I'm like, maybe you're not pissed off enough. Do you think I'm gonna go sell something the VA big China? Again, you're an idiot.

Keith McKeever 44:45

Right? It's like, well, who's the intended user at the end of the day? It's unfolded.

Joe Meisch 44:49

Okay, we're my company's a veteran, registered vendor. And we're right about to go for a contract. And I'm thinking to myself if I would have taken money from investors and they told me to make it China, I'd be screwed by idiots. But you don't I did. I sacrificed a career. And I made it happen. It's made USA. And I don't have one regret dude, I would do this out of a cardboard box. I'm a happy guy, bro. Okay, just That's My nature. And I'm a hard worker. And don't ever estimate, don't ever misunderstand or underestimate people that are nice people that are kind and generous for wheat. Because it's, it's, it's it's actually got kindness, love and compassion for my brothers and sisters. That makes me strong. And that's power brother. So why are these people telling me well, we want to make it in China. Oh, my God, you're an idiot next. So there's a bunch of other BS I had to put up with investors. They got their ego wrapped and everything and Oh, my God, I remember one investor told me he's like, Oh, you gotta have skin in the game? Like, really? How many years did you serve in the service of whatever branch? I don't care? None. Okay, great. And I got $180,000 in my business. What if you got into it? And you're gonna sit there with your ego and your bullshit arrogance, and asked me how much skin I got in the game? kick rocks, cool, baby. So yeah, we're made to say that ain't never gonna change.

Keith McKeever 46:19

Yeah, I don't blame you. I mean, at the end of the day, you got to you got to live with yourself to say like, Okay, I want to help people. But you know, this that supports American jobs

Joe Meisch 46:30

in my company has, I think 13 Different companies supply chain 13 Other companies to make this. Dude, if I made in China, all them companies business will be gone. It's an exponential impact on an economy when you're a manufacturer here at home, and I never lost sight of that. And, boy, it's a good thing. I'm not passionate about this.

Keith McKeever 46:56

You need to step your game up a little bit there. there somewhere.

Joe Meisch 47:00

We'll go closer.

Keith McKeever 47:02

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So I guess one last question, I want to ask you, kind of just going back to the creative side of creating things. I'm sure there's a lot of veterans out there that are listening and saying, you know, Joe, I've got this, you told me they can reach out to you for advice, but maybe they got something that they're somewhere in that process, they got this idea or they got a prototype or they're trying to grow things. What kind of advice do you have for those people, you know, when they when they start running into brick wall? Okay, so

Joe Meisch 47:31

right off the bat, I want to tell people, if you're thinking about a product or patent, feel free to write me Joe temple massager.com. There's a lot of pitfalls. There are a lot of advisors that are scumbags. If he gives you bullshit advice, and you're going to pay him for it, and you're gonna lose your money. I can totally Yeah, like the advisor class people, they want your money, they don't care if your ideas sinks or swims. Okay. So I will offer advice all the time, and no problem. So one thing I would say I hear a lot of, Oh, I heard that if you mail your idea to yourself, and you don't open it that that's a patent on like, if you're an idiot, sure you have an idiot, patent right on congratulations. No, that's not true. At all. I just I've just heard the other day, my my friend wants to patent to do an app, you know, and he brings it up like, Oh, God, no, that is not true, dude.

Keith McKeever 48:23

Mark office, like for a reason, you have to finally

Joe Meisch 48:27

do it. Exactly. So don't ever fall for the bullshit cut a corner, you're not going to cut a quarter. If you have an lentil intellectual property. You either have a patent trademark or copyright. That's intellectual property period. If you don't have a patent, trademark or copyright, you have nothing. So you can go out and get a provisional patent from the USP PTO, US patent trademark office uspto.gov. Be careful when you're clicking around because there's people that want to say they're uspto.com or you know, dot scam is what they really are. So you are not in the right place, unless you're at a dot geo V. Website.

Keith McKeever 49:08

Period. Absolutely.

Joe Meisch 49:10

Yep. So be careful when you're clicking around, you might click on something that looks like it's a Patent and Trademark Office, but then just suddenly, you're not there. And it's all so you can go get look at a provisional patent. I think they're 150 bucks or 75 bucks, I did that. It gives you one year patent pending protection. So you can explore prototype, get somebody to build something and you have to have that room to fail. You know, in an entrepreneur world. You always hear fail fast. Well, digital The reason you want to fail fast because you can quit spending money on bad idea, but you're gonna have to sacrifice. You got to sacrifice a little bit to flush out the idea. I didn't know that Tom was large enough to hold tool. I didn't see that at all. And that's what it came to be. So the point is, you got to have that room to experiment. prototype test. And before that one years up, you have to file a full blown patent. Right? And so once that provisional patents up, that's it, you're done. So before you get the end of your year, you have to submit the paperwork to get a patent. That way you have a filing date, right? So let's say, somebody filed for a patent because, you know, I'm in California, maybe somebody in New Hampshire had an idea like I did. And they happen to file it the day after I did. Well, I have the first right, because my filing date was a day before the guy or gal in New Hampshire, just as an example. So you got to get your stuff filed. And I'd be happy to share what I know with people. If you're going to, you know, I'm like, hey, if I'm a construction guy, and I think a lot of figure out how to write and patterns, and I got a degree in geography and geology, and I worked in gold mining a little while, but if I can do it, you can do it too. It's just tough because it eats a lot of time. And you're gonna have to make sacrifices, man. Yeah, there were a lot of times I couldn't go out and party. I couldn't go to the show. I didn't have money to take out the girls. So you're alone, because chicks don't dig dudes to sit read medical papers at night that are broke?

Keith McKeever 51:25

Yeah, one thing I know. Yeah. I'll piggyback off of that, that I heard years ago. Actually, I heard it on another podcast. And I've said this many times in my business, and I think I've said it a few times on the podcast. Cheap is expensive. I wish I could give credit to wherever I heard this. But if you try to cut the corners, and you do some things yourself, or you go to some of these services, cut those corners that can be expensive.

Joe Meisch 51:48

If they're going to charge you too much. You got

Keith McKeever 51:52

to find that person who is going to take care of your business and do some things. I will say for those who are listening if you're in that boat, Andy Nelson is an attorney. I interviewed him last year on my podcast about patent and trademark intellectual property rights attorney in California. awesome guy. They can kick people can connect with him through my website, too. So

Joe Meisch 52:14

let me give you another resource. This is Craig. Stain Brook. He's in Santa Rosa, California. Craig, Dane Brook, Santa Rosa, California. He's a first class attorney. I've worked with these guys cost money. So like me, I didn't have money back. And so I had to write the patent and you can too, you can figure it out. You get other people's patents that look kind of like yours. And fill in the blanks with your information. So you know, there's another resource for you.

Keith McKeever 52:46

Absolutely. I'll, I'll get his information. We'll get that in the show notes. And then one other

Joe Meisch 52:50

one is a man manufacturer prototyper Air Force veteran Larry child's, like it sounds child, Larry child's design it prototype Rohnert Park, California, Larry child's design it prototype Rohnert. Park, California, he took my ideas out of my head and crappy prototype and made him into an actual prototype. So there's two resources for the people, and they're not gonna gouge you rip you off, like, steal from you. So there's some of my assets. I hope it can help other people.

Keith McKeever 53:25

I love a joke because that's one of my goals of every show is to educate and inspire. And that gives somebody some actionable places to go to get. Okay. So, I appreciate it. Joe, any any last words of wisdom?

Joe Meisch 53:39

Man, take care yourself, you're worth it. You know, it's ugly and hard. Just do something to get through the next day. Love yourself, you're worth it. I want you around. And I'm always here to chat with people. So God bless everybody, man, you're worth it. No matter what you've been through in your life, you are worth it. So do whatever you need to do to take care of yourself and reach out for help. Don't be ashamed Don't be alone and reach out to somebody.

Keith McKeever 54:06

Awesome. I appreciate it. And like I said, once again, I appreciate you coming on here. This is an awesome device and and I know this is gonna help a lot of people and it's been a pleasure to have you on here and and highlight this. Sorry.

Joe Meisch 54:19

Thank you very much for having me on again. We're gonna we're going

Joe Meisch 54:23

to go